MTB 670

Motor Torpedo Boats (MTB)
Croatian Navy
Petty Officer
Posts: 32
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:59 am

Re: MTB 670

Postby Croatian Navy » Sun Mar 04, 2012 1:21 pm

Radar system on this photo seems tooo modern for 1944/1945. But maybe I am wrong.

davidddnfp
Seaman
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2012 8:18 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby davidddnfp » Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:14 pm

futher to my meeting with my researcher concerning mtb 670 he has pointed out on the subject of the torpedo tubes being removed ,notes made on dads comments show that the tubes were removed when they were on mine sweeping manoveres this was done for safety reasons because of the cables they used also our freind the commander had supplied us with a newspaper cliping telling the story of radio controled boats being loaded with high explosive against enemy shipping hence the aerials as for the number being removed it would be quite obvious looking at the story of the famous general for instance had the enemy known the number of the boat he was on it would have made an easy target as for the radar yes it does look modern i said this before another reason why the boat was highly protected we have been zooming in on the photo one can see the skipper checking out the aircraft the photo is being taken from with his binoculars also guns are pointing at the ready the crew are wearing navy blue ovaralls i remember dad saying this is what they wore because he always wore them for work i asked him once why he didn't wear something else that's when he explained he got used to them when on board the boat the tubes would have been replaced once mine sweeping was finished as i have said before there has been a lot of cover up one can't always beleive what one reads.

cdsc123
Sub Lieutenant
Posts: 76
Joined: Wed Jul 22, 2009 6:38 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby cdsc123 » Wed Mar 07, 2012 2:34 pm

I think the boat in the photo is FPB 5020 (decommissioned 1956).

Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 351
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2009 7:40 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby Admin » Wed Mar 07, 2012 4:14 pm

futher to my meeting with my researcher concerning mtb 670 he has pointed out on the subject of the torpedo tubes being removed ,notes made on dads comments show that the tubes were removed when they were on mine sweeping manoveres this was done for safety reasons...
SOE and The Resistance: As Told in Times Obituaries (ISBN 9781441119711) published just last year by Continuum Publishing, has a whole section on Yugoslavia, and covers all the colourful characters who would likely have been carried on a CF boat for any reason involving the resistance movements, though in truth most of the time they were parachuted into the mountainous terrain strongholds of the Partisans.

As for MTB 670, the definitive historical record remains that of the photographs posted by jonco, which are those of a late-war Mediterranean ‘Dog boat’, which quite clearly would not have had its torpedoes, additional guns, state-of-the-art radar, and even its Carley float suddenly exchanged for what can be seen in your photograph.

jonco
Chief Petty Officer
Posts: 52
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:47 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby jonco » Wed Mar 07, 2012 4:16 pm

Re CDSC123 comment
According to the following link

http://www.rjerrard.co.uk/royalnavy/his ... p2009.html

there is photo of FPB 5020 on page 254 of Dog Boats at War - does anybody have a copy for comparison?

jonco
Chief Petty Officer
Posts: 52
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:47 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby jonco » Wed Mar 07, 2012 8:00 pm

Another distant picture of MTB 670 and another crew member - exact dates again unknown but between Oct 44 and July 45.
Manfredonia - fishing vessel with MTB 670 in background.jpg
Alf Cook - MTB 670.jpg

Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 351
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2009 7:40 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby Admin » Thu Mar 08, 2012 1:56 am

I think the boat in the photo is FPB 5020 (decommissioned 1956).
Yes, John Lambert's book on the Fairmile D contains a drawing of FPB 5001 (former MTB 780) as of 1954, having the same forward, mid, and aft armament as shown in the photo, together with the clear wheelhouse, and which depicts the whip ariels and a lattice mast. He describes this boat as a control craft for directing the Gay and Dark Class FPBs, and the photo certainly has the look of a post-war craft dedicated to such communications.

Pioneer
Moderator
Posts: 322
Joined: Sun Oct 19, 2008 12:48 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby Pioneer » Thu Mar 08, 2012 12:54 pm

Admin... John Lambert's book on the Fairmile D contains a drawing of FPB 5001 (former MTB 780) as of 1954, having the same forward, mid, and aft armament as shown in the photo, together with the clear wheelhouse, and which depicts the whip ariels and a lattice mast. He describes this boat as a control craft for directing the Gay and Dark Class FPBs, and the photo certainly has the look of a post-war craft dedicated to such communications.
With kind permission of John Lambert we are able to reproduce this line drawing of FPB 5001 (click for larger image)
mtb-5001.jpg
Drawing by J. Lambert.
As this is a Plan view, the far set of twin whip aerials would not be drawn.

Toward the end of the book 'Allied Coastal Forces at War. Volume 1' there is a valuable precis of the developement of Radar for CF, later I am hoping to get the title and authour of an important two volume reference source that John Lambert had used.

davidddnfp
Seaman
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2012 8:18 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby davidddnfp » Thu Mar 08, 2012 3:26 pm

thanks to everyone for their help on their response to our request to find out more about mtb 670 we never did claim the photo we had was 670 but obviously we needed to clarify it was not it still leaves all the info we have and the story that is building up to be sorted it's frustrating at times we cannot speak to the commander anymore as he is no longer with us another meeting with my researcher at the weekend will take recent info to him and see what he comes up with thanks to jonco for sharing his fathers photos with us it has been a great help will keep everyone posted as we progress

DARREN
Seaman
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2012 2:10 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby DARREN » Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:15 pm

Hi jonco,

I have been reading some of the posts regarding MTB 670, and have printed them off for a more leisurely read at home. I realise I am some months behind, and don't know how far your investigation has gone, but I came across your post by chance. The reason for my interest, is that my Grandad is Lofty Turner. Unforunately he passed away a long time ago, aged only 56, and I was never at an age to understand about the war, or to ask any questions. I know the servicemen rarely spoke about their experience's and I believe my Grandad was the same, but I have been meaning for some time to try and find some details of his service. My Dad enquired for some details regarding the award of his DSM, but apart from that, all I know is that he was a gunner and stationed in Malta. If your investigations are still current, and you have any history I would be grateful to hear anything you know, or if you could point me in the right direction to start my own investigations I would be very grateful.

jonco
Chief Petty Officer
Posts: 52
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:47 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby jonco » Wed Dec 05, 2012 8:16 pm

Hi Darren,
Good to hear from you. I had rather given up on finding any further information. My dad died 10 years ago (aged 79) and it was only afterwards that I became aware of his photo album. I have posted a number of those photos on this forum and they included the one of 'Lofty' Turner which had the caption of 'on MTB 670'. I presume that Lofty Turner was Able Seaman Wilfred Turner C/JX 374043 RN DSM and I understand your grandad was awarded the DSM for actions in August '44 - see information from Brian Holmes on page 1 of this thread. My father was not on MTB 670 at this time he was busy getting sunk on ML 563 in the Med.

I think others ( Brian Holmes/ Croatian Navy) will be able to add more information - but there are snippets and references in the text above.

I would suggest that you apply for his full service and medals record. These should help you but be prepared that they may not be fully accurate. This is one route to get them http://www.veterans-uk.info/service_rec ... cords.html
Best of luck -
Colin

DARREN
Seaman
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2012 2:10 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby DARREN » Fri Dec 07, 2012 1:40 pm

Hi Colin,

Thanks very much for your help. My Grandad is indeed Able Seaman Wilfred Turner, and as I said I have very little info about his service during the war, but now I have somewhere to start. I know my Dad is now very keen to find out more, after I rang and told him of your Dad's pictures, and all the correspondence between the various people involved. I am going up to see him at the weekend, so hopefully I will be able to get him registered on this site, and keep him updated on any findings.
Once again, thanks very much for your help and maybe if there is any fresh discoveries we could keep each other informed.
All the best
Darren

Terry Turner
Seaman
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Dec 08, 2012 5:00 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby Terry Turner » Mon Dec 10, 2012 4:26 pm

Hello Colin, my son Darren informed me of this website and I thought I would post this information about my fathers awards while serving on MTB 670.I had to apply to the Admiralty for this as my dad appears to have been like most servicemen and never spoke of it.He was mentioned in despatches for action on the night of 17/18 July 1944 when MTB670 along with MTB649 and MGB659 sank three enemy vessels and damaged another off Lirica Island. He was awarded the DSM for action on the 25/26th July 1944 when along with MTBs 651 and 667 they engaged a convoy of 1 400-ton flak schooner,2 "I" Boats and 5 "E" Boats off Peljesac and destroyed the schooner,both "I"boats and 3 "E" boats and damaged the other two which escaped.His citation states that as 2pdr gunner he scored direct hits on the schooner which exploded and burnt to the waters edge, an "E" boat which burst into flames amidship and on a second "E" boat that exploded violently a nd hits on an "I"boat with no obvious result. I hope that this will help in your search for information on MTB670 . Good luck Terry Turner

jonco
Chief Petty Officer
Posts: 52
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:47 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby jonco » Mon Dec 10, 2012 8:13 pm

Hi Terry,
Welcome aboard as they say.
Thanks for info - hope the photo I posted is a good likenesss of your dad. I am going to re-check the album (my mother has it at the moment) I vaguely recall the caption said `Lofty Turner on 6 pounder' which ties in with his role. I think @Croatian Navy has done a lot of research on this topic - it maybe worth pm'ing him.

Cheers

Colin

davidddnfp
Seaman
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2012 8:18 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby davidddnfp » Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:34 pm

Hi Jonco sorry we have been a long time getting in contact went to visit my mother yesterday bless her at the ripe old age of 84 years old she still remembers various things dad spoke to her about concerning mtb 670 as she has just bought a new laptop i was able to show her this site she looked at the photos you posted out came the magnifying glass fourth photo down of the crew second man in from right with all the black hair [got told off , 'what's up with you boy don't you regonise your father when you see him? sorry mum apparently his hair would stick up like that after they had been swimming they would play a lot of water polo to try and take their minds of things 'i know my cecil when i see him she said, ok mum. cecil was dad's nickname] so we now know dad is in the photo also she said that dad often spoke about lofty must be lofty turner she pointed out there were some funny times one being that dad and lofty had to cook baked beans on toast for everybody 27 people all told so they put the tins of beans in pans of hot water to heat them up but failed to pierce the cans the obvious happened and the cans exploded covering the gally walls in baked beans needless to say the skipper was not very happy ,nice to hear these stories, i am going to see her again in a couple of weeks and have asked her to try and remember what she can and take notes she says she will do her best our researcher is still hard at it moaning about people who think they know and they don't but we will keep persevering best regards david

jonco
Chief Petty Officer
Posts: 52
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:47 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby jonco » Sat Jan 12, 2013 9:53 am

David - glad your mum is still helping you out after all the years - that's what they do!

CAM
Sub Lieutenant
Posts: 77
Joined: Sat Mar 29, 2014 8:49 am

Re: MTB 670

Postby CAM » Sun Jun 01, 2014 1:11 pm


13 April 45 British motor torpedo boats MTB-670 and MTB-697 torpedoed and sunk the torpedo boat TA-45.
The London Gazette entry for the second of actions listed may be read online by clicking the link provided. The actual citation reads:
There is a report on this action? Participated in the action of the MGB-658 and MGB-643?

jonco
Chief Petty Officer
Posts: 52
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:47 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby jonco » Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:50 pm

Hello Cam,

I confess I have not looked at this for sometime as I could not find any further information.
I have even had to read back through the post to refresh my memory. I don't recall finding an actual report of the action only the reference to the citation. I will keep looking in my records.

Your question may re-ignite the interest of other participants in the thread but if not maybe you could pm @croatian navy or @davidddnfp as they were doing a lot of research in this area.

Will let you know if I find anything

Cheers
Colin

CAM
Sub Lieutenant
Posts: 77
Joined: Sat Mar 29, 2014 8:49 am

Re: MTB 670

Postby CAM » Mon Jun 02, 2014 6:53 pm

Trying to reconstruct the course of this action. With the German and Croatian versions I know. Lacking only English descriptions best report.

CAM
Sub Lieutenant
Posts: 77
Joined: Sat Mar 29, 2014 8:49 am

Re: MTB 670

Postby CAM » Sun Jul 06, 2014 1:12 pm


For an attack on enemy forces in the Planinski channel on 12 Apr 1945
Temporary Lieutenant Eric Hewitt RNVR DSC
Able Seaman Thomas Conway C/JX 559543 RN MID
Able Seaman Henry Harrison C/JX 542116 RN MID
Temporary Sub-Lieutenant James Oliver Young RNVR MID
Means results in a German ship made ​​it MTB-670?
The whole group was commanded by Lieutenant-kommander Montgomery MGB-658, which, together with the MGB-643 fired a German survivor. Germans write that existing U.S. radar allowed the British to get close to 500m, and only time seen German flagship launch torpedoes allowed him at the last moment to evade them by passing them on the bow and stern.

Peter
Able Seaman Radar
Posts: 92
Joined: Mon Oct 20, 2008 7:41 pm

Re: MTB 670

Postby Peter » Tue Jul 08, 2014 1:11 pm

The last post of MTB 670 was of great interest where it mentioned the Planinsky channel and the date April 12th 1945
it was only 2 days before on the 10th that we on MGB647 again with MGB 643 was in action with F Lighters where MGB 647 sustained serious above water damage and remarkably no causalties , and after temporary repairs by shipwrights on HMS Colombo in the port of Zara now Zadar we were able to make the long journey to Island of Ischia off Naples .
There is also a very detailed account of that action of MTB 670 and MGB 643 in Rover Reynolds book " Dog Boats at War " page 234 where he records the later information from German records of the action , and also a letter had received much later from a Yugoslav diving instructor re the siting of the wreck of a sunken German destroyer

CAM
Sub Lieutenant
Posts: 77
Joined: Sat Mar 29, 2014 8:49 am

Re: MTB 670

Postby CAM » Tue Jul 08, 2014 7:14 pm

There is also a very detailed account of that action of MTB 670 and MGB 643 in Rover Reynolds book " Dog Boats at War " page 234 where he records the later information from German records of the action , and also a letter had received much later from a Yugoslav diving instructor re the siting of the wreck of a sunken German destroyer

I am familiar with an excerpt from the diary of military Birnbaum and memories of one of the officers of the TA-45. Books Reynolds unfortunately I do not have, and the Internet, I found it too, but would like to know about the actions of British sailors from the English source.


Return to “Motor Torpedo Boats”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 2 guests

cron