identification of base 1944

Motor Torpedo Boats (MTB)
chipmunkmk10
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identification of base 1944

Postby chipmunkmk10 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 6:22 pm

I am looking for the name of the base in the picture attached . My father was a crew member on MTB's during 1943/1944 in the dover area serving the Royal Netherland Navy . Last ship was MTB 437 former MGB437 .
Attachments
DOORNBOS-KM-MOTOR.jpg

Admin
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Re: identification of base 1944

Postby Admin » Wed Sep 23, 2020 7:04 pm

If it was Dover it would have been HMS Wasp, but the best known elements of that were the pens in the harbour used by Coastal Forces, and the Lord Warden Hotel, whose building still exists, which formed the Officers’ Mess and the general administration centre. I don’t recognise anything shown in the photograph, but could not suggest any other possible location based on where the Dutch crews were based.

Admin

chipmunkmk10
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Re: identification of base 1944

Postby chipmunkmk10 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 7:29 pm

i got a hint it could be a shooting range as the men are wearing khaki instead of blue ? Further more is there a picture of a footbal team also 1944 with coloured men in it . To my knowledge there were no colourd crews . maybe an army base near?
Attachments
DOORNBOS-ELFTAL.jpg

reinaart
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Re: identification of base 1944

Postby reinaart » Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:58 pm

What strikes me as odd is that the motor bike in the first pic has a "KM" marking which stands for Koninklijke Marine. I assume that motor vehicles assigned to foreign volunteers in the RN would have had RN markings. If this is indeed the case, the pic was probably not taken in England .

Groet,

Arjan

chipmunkmk10
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Re: identification of base 1944

Postby chipmunkmk10 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:52 pm

100% picture is in England 1944 .

reinaart
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Re: identification of base 1944

Postby reinaart » Wed Sep 23, 2020 11:03 pm

Your second pic can also be found here (scroll down), it is suggested it may have been taken in Terneuzen or England. I think the former is very likely (I know the Terneuzen region well), it would would also explain the colored men.

https://www.bevrijdingintercultureel.nl ... iname.html

Arjan

chipmunkmk10
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Re: identification of base 1944

Postby chipmunkmk10 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:30 am

Top left blond guy is my father . He was a member of shore party 3004 arriving with "oranje Nassau " . Probably football team could be Terneuzen . The pictures is in my collection . What is the story of the coloured men . British army ??

reinaart
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Re: identification of base 1944

Postby reinaart » Thu Sep 24, 2020 12:53 pm

The colored men were probably Dutch marines from the former Dutch colonies and comrades of Frank Koulen :

"England
In England Frank Koulen, and probably also his fellow marines, are stationed aboard the Marine Depot ship ‘Oranje Nassau’ and after that on the Hr. Ms. ‘Jacob van Heemskerck’. From August 1941 until 1945 the ‘Oranje Nassau’ is in use as a boarding facility and she is moored at Holyhead in the Nort-West of Wales. On 14 June 1944 the Jacob van Heemskerck arrives in Gladstone Docks of the Cammel Laird shipyard in Liverpool and stays there for a year for repairs. It lies 150 kilometers from Holyhead. Both ships therefore are not considered as a transport possibility for the marines from the U.S. to England or from there to Boulogne-sur-Mer.

Battle of the Scheldt Mouth
One can assume the entire group of marines were transported to Boulogne end September-early October, to take part in the operations to liberate The Netherlands. From one of them, Frank Koulen, it is known that he is officially stationed on 20 October at the marine base Naval Party 3004 in Terneuzen. From here he takes part in operations to secure a safe passage on the Scheldt to Antwerp for the allied transports (2 October-8 November 1944). Also the surveillance of this area until the end of the war will have been one of their tasks."

Frank Koulen was a celebrity in Terneuzen, he stayed in Terneuzen married a Dutch girl and founded a jazz cafe named Porgy & Bess. This cafe is still in business under its original name. Some time ago even a statue of Frank Koulen was erected to honour him.

"PORGY & BESS
In 1944 marcheert Surinamer Frank Koulen als korporaal-hoornblazer de stad Terneuzen binnen. Hij is een bezienswaardigheid, want in Terneuzen heeft men nog nooit een ‘echte neger’ gezien! Mensen willen hem zien en aanraken… Koulen wordt ingekwartierd in het kantongerechtsgebouw aan de Markt (nu: restaurant ’t Gerecht). In 1947 trouwt Frank Koulen met Vera van den Bruele. Tien jaar later opent het stel lunchroom Porgy & Bess, genoemd naar de gelijknamige opera. Frank wordt bekend als ‘de neger’. Porgy & Bess groeit uit tot een fenomeen in Terneuzen en ver daarbuiten. Hij brengt livemuziek en zijn lunchroom wordt al gauw een soort nachtclub. Hij brengt jazzmuziek onder de aandacht van generaties Zeeuws-Vlamingen. In 1969 organiseert hij het eerste Jazz Festival in Terneuzen tijdens de plaatselijke braderie. Anno 2016 is er echter veel meer te zien en te horen in Porgy & Bess dan alleen jazz: je kunt er ook genieten van blues, viool- en pianoconcerten, (literaire) lezingen, lokale bands, cabaret- en toneelvoorstellingen, Franse films, bigbands en nog veel meer."


Arjan

chipmunkmk10
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Re: identification of base 1944

Postby chipmunkmk10 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:14 pm

Wat een verhaal ,het zou zomaar mogelijk zijn dat de voorliefde van hem voor de trompet daar ontstaan is !!Zijn er meer fotos van Terneuzen Navl Party 3004 ?

Stephen
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Re: identification of base 1944

Postby Stephen » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:51 pm

I can't help with the location specifically, but it's worth noting that the sign on the building behind the motor bike appears to say Victualling Office.

reinaart
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Re: identification of base 1944

Postby reinaart » Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:09 am

Your certainly have excellent eyesight Stephen !

Chipmunk, I've got many period pics of Terneuzen showing VE day, the clearing of the Scheldt etc. There are quite a few IWM pics showing Terneuzen and the type of activities your dad may have been involved in :

https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/sear ... %20Antwerp

Groet,

Arjan

chipmunkmk10
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Re: identification of base 1944

Postby chipmunkmk10 » Sat Sep 26, 2020 9:26 pm

I can't help with the location specifically, but it's worth noting that the sign on the building behind the motor bike appears to say Victualling Office.
What is Victualling office ???? And is this common on a navy base ??
And can you decifer the text on the tall building where the guy with the bucket is walking ??

chipmunkmk10
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Posts: 8
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2020 6:15 pm

Re: identification of base 1944

Postby chipmunkmk10 » Sat Sep 26, 2020 9:32 pm

Your certainly have excellent eyesight Stephen !

Chipmunk, I've got many period pics of Terneuzen showing VE day, the clearing of the Scheldt etc. There are quite a few IWM pics showing Terneuzen and the type of activities your dad may have been involved in :

https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/sear ... %20Antwerp

Groet,

Arjan
I zou graag de foto's zien van VE day in Terneuzen. In de parade lopen nogal wat Nederlandse marine mensen .

reinaart
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Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2014 9:49 am

Re: identification of base 1944

Postby reinaart » Sun Sep 27, 2020 8:57 am

I sent you a private message containing my email address so drop me a mail and I will send you what I've got. An acquaintance of mine has better quality images of the parade footage. This video should be interesting for you :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbkMRQxBMIc

Some rare pics :

Image
Image
Image
Image

Arjan

Stephen
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Re: identification of base 1944

Postby Stephen » Sun Sep 27, 2020 12:35 pm

I can't help with the location specifically, but it's worth noting that the sign on the building behind the motor bike appears to say Victualling Office.
What is Victualling office ???? And is this common on a navy base ??
And can you decifer the text on the tall building where the guy with the bucket is walking ??

A victualling yard (in larger docks) issued supplies to vessels, principally food and drink. Even small bases will have had an office to manage this. Note that although this in in English, it doesn't mean it's England, as bases established overseas will have set up an office as well.

I'm afraid I can't identify the other bit of writing (it looks like it could be writing I agree, but it might not be).

chipmunkmk10
Seaman
Posts: 8
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2020 6:15 pm

Re: identification of base 1944

Postby chipmunkmk10 » Sun Sep 27, 2020 2:57 pm

I can't help with the location specifically, but it's worth noting that the sign on the building behind the motor bike appears to say Victualling Office.
What is Victualling office ???? And is this common on a navy base ??
And can you decifer the text on the tall building where the guy with the bucket is walking ??

A victualling yard (in larger docks) issued supplies to vessels, principally food and drink. Even small bases will have had an office to manage this. Note that although this in in English, it doesn't mean it's England, as bases established overseas will have set up an office as well.

I'm afraid I can't identify the other bit of writing (it looks like it could be writing I agree, but it might not be).

The buildings are not dutch for sure !!!


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